Transcript: Mr. Lewis on Debate, Mentorship, and Building Legacy

Welcome back to the Late Start Show with me, Charlie Martin, and me, Jack Nelson. We once again hope you're enjoying your nice break from waking up at the crack of dawn. Hopefully, we can give you something good to listen to on your morning commute to school. This week's interview is with Mr. Mark Burns, a graduate of U.S. Class of 1972 and a recipient of the Distinguished Alumni of the Year Award for U.S. in 2012. He joins the podcast to tell us about his journey, starting as an orphan and going on to become a prominent business leader and philanthropist. But before we get to that great interview, let's first review what this week has to offer. Let's get to our sports section. Soccer, the team tied Gilmore on Thursday 0-0, which led them to an overall record of 8-4-4. Leads them to a state ranking of 41st. With the final regular season game of the year, they look forward to the playoffs, where this... Upcoming Saturday at 1, they face the winner of Acra North and NDCL at home. They fight for a chance to make the next round of the district tournament, facing the winner of 22-seed Norton and 36-seed Medina Buckeyes next. Hopefully, they can pull off a win that will propel them into the rest of the postseason. Next, in football, we lost to Cheney on Friday, leading them to a record of 3-5. The team has two games left in the regular season, with a game this Friday against Don Prep at home. At 5... The team is looking forward to beating them to face Howland in our final regular season game of the year. In golf, the boys played at the OHSAA D1 State Championship, where they placed 7th out of 12 teams. Although they didn't win, the boys played in 30-degree weather with windy and rainy conditions, and Jackson Penny led the team, being a 14th best out of 72 high schoolers across the state. He had a score of 151, the team having an overall score of... They had a great season overall, and we thank the seniors for their hard work and look forward to the upcoming season as they only get better to finally bring home a trophy. With that, we finally go to cross country, where they did not have a meet this past Saturday, but look forward to having the first meet of the postseason for the OHSAA D1 District Tournament at Madison High School this upcoming Saturday. This is the team's chance to show off their impressive times and hopefully advance further. Good luck to them. Now, some of the biggest news around the school. This past week, the Languages Department hosted a three-day soccer tournament in honor of Hispanic Heritage Month. After many hard-fought games, Spanish and Mandarin faced off in the final, the Spanish taking the win, while the U.S. Jazz Ensemble played while we ate. Also, tickets are now on sale for U.S.'s fall play, Agatha Christie's Spider Web. It will be performed on October 25th and 26th at 7 p.m. in the auditorium. Tickets are available online or for purchase at the door. And this is Director Mr. Sanborn's first play, so make sure we come out to support him. Looking at our week's senior speeches, we had no speeches this week due to the day off on Monday and a special day on Tuesday, so we'll continue to look forward to speeches next week from Z. McGee, Tyler Zyro, and Casey Martin. Well, guys, that's enough from us about this week. Coming up soon is an interview from, He sat down with us to talk about his storied childhood, his journey to become a great businessman, and some incredibly valuable life advice. All right, let's jump into it. Mr. Burns, up next.

Welcome back to the show. We are here with Mr. Mark Burns, a graduate of U.S. Class of 1972 and recipient of Distinguished Alumni of the Year Award for U.S. in 2012. How are you, Mr. Burns? Feeling distinguished, thank you. You know, firstly, as someone who's achieved so much, professionally, and I know we're going to get into that, looking back, what was the biggest takeaway from your years at university school that's just stayed with you? The relationships, that simple. Have you continued, like, holding those friends close to you that you've had while you were at U.S.? You know, surprisingly enough, the answer to that is absolutely. In fact, I was with no less than eight of my classmates last week, had dinner with one just, in fact, last night with his beautiful bride. Wow. That's amazing to hear because a lot of people talk about, you know, their high school friends. They're only for high school, then everyone moves on. But it's cool to hear that at U.S., just stick with them. Well, you know, we create such a camaraderie and collegiality among the guys here, and, you know, these are lifelong relationships. And the coaches and the mentors that I had at this school were just extraordinary. And I just feel so honored to be able to hang around just with you guys right now. This is really cool. Thank you for having me. So, Charlie and I have both had the privilege of hearing a little about your journey through life. And while reading some of your interviews, you mentioned your unique childhood. Can you tell us some of that story? Sure. I am beyond blessed and fortunate. I was orphaned, placed in foster care, and ultimately adopted by the time I was one by a beautiful couple, Judy and Larry Burns. And to be perfectly candid with you, I am the lucky one. Because it turned out my birth parents, I found out 17 years ago, actually did get married. And they wound up having five kids, of which I was the oldest, and they found me, literally, 17 years ago. So it turns out I have five younger brothers and sisters, unfortunately, one of whom passed just recently. But notwithstanding, why was I so lucky? Because I was raised in the orphanage at Belfair, literally less than two miles from university school. And my parents sacrificed greatly to be able to pay my tuition. In fact, my mom, to her credit, actually took on the responsibility of a job from 5 to 11 o'clock virtually every weeknight. She would earn money by selling photography for weddings and bar mitzvahs and whatnot for a local photographer. And that's how she earned enough money to pay my tuition. And that's how she earned enough money to pay my tuition. And that's how she earned enough money to pay my tuition. Probably from about the 6th grade, beginning in 1965, until probably I was in the 9th or 10th grade in the early 70s. So, yeah. So I was very blessed. Seeing how hard your parents worked for your education, how did that motivate you to make the most out of your time at U.S.? Well, you know, having grown up back in the 50s and the 60s, one of the things you guys got to keep in mind and remember is that my parents, you know, they came out of the Depression. And their parents, literally, at one point in time, were on bread lines. All right? All right. And when you hear stories like that and interact with your grandparents and then realize the value of what they went through, and, you know, my dad fought in the war. He was in World War II over in the Pacific for a period of time. The two of them, when they started, didn't have two nickels to rub together. He was a nickel-and-dime bankruptcy lawyer trying to find his way in the world. And she would sacrifice greatly even for him to pay his tuition through law school. You kind of grow up feeling certainly not entitled, but very fortunate to have parents that have such an extraordinary work ethic. So that and my grandparents as well. And again, they adopted me, so I was the lucky one, kind of like the chosen one, if you will. And eventually, it wound up at university school, which was just uncommon back then. You know, having that unique experience, looking back at your early childhood, are there any fond memories or just lessons that you learned throughout those years that really just stick with you? Yeah. And I want to address this with you in particular, Charlie. My family lived in Beachwood initially on Concord Drive and Beacon. And the family next to us, was a large Catholic family. They had like six kids. And I was like an only child, because Judy and Larry didn't have any other children other than me. I view that as a plus and a minus, but notwithstanding. The Canfields were our next-door neighbor, and they ultimately sold their house and moved out, which was heartbreaking for me, because they taught me how to play football, baseball, basketball, and hang out with a lot of good kids. But they put their house on the market, and an African-American couple, this is 1963, came in to take a look at it. And the Canfields received horrific notifications, along with the realtor, not to sell. They sold their home to an African-American family. And they did. And I don't remember specifically, was the night the Canfields moved out, or the night the Lewis family moved in. But they burned a cross on their lawn. And I'll never forget waking up at 3 o'clock in the morning and feeling absolutely overwhelmed and scared. But Billy and Ronnie Lewis became two of my best buddies, and we played baseball in the front yard. And the neighborhood bully went by one day on his bicycle, and he was yelling stupid obscenities. You know, I'm Jewish, so anti-Semitic, and then racist comments. And I don't know what possessed me, but I ran, I knocked this kid off the bicycle. He was like twice my size. And my Uncle Arthur, who was a boxer, taught me how to box, and I gave him a great right fist. And then he proceeded to pummel the hell out of me. And I went home bloody and beaten, and my mother would say to me, what happened? And Ronnie Lewis said, he stood up for us. He stood up for us. And I'll never forget that. That's really, really cool. How has that experience just as a whole shaped your idea on inclusion, and like equality, and how those values influence how you lead and give back today? Yeah, you know, one of the greatest things that I had attending university school was I played in the first ever backfield with the first ever African American. His name was Sandy Cargill, who went on to Princeton. Great athlete, basketball player, track star, and one of the most incredibly humble guys that I ever met with. And to be able to be on the same field with him was pretty cool, because there weren't a lot of Jewish kids at university school back in the 60s, and there certainly weren't many African Americans. In fact, I think Sandy was one of maybe three or four at best. So if you look fast forward in terms of the extraordinary place the U.S. is in today, talk about diversity and equity and inclusion, I'm just so proud of where this school is in terms of how it's basically incorporated and provided a tremendous amount of, not just financially, but welcoming to wonderful guys like you, whose dads are superstars in the medical field and can afford to pay the tuition here, which is great. But, you know, I think U.S. has come a long way in that regard, and in particular with our curriculum and an opening to giving back to the community. And I think a lot of that was born back over the course of the last 30, 40 years because of having on board a lot of great students like you guys. I know you currently are the freshman football coach. How does your involvement in U.S. sports when you were a kid influence your leadership style and your approach to teamwork that you had later in life? Oh, that's really easy.

Coach Callow was my idol. And the Callow Room, which is named today, back in the day, I wanted to make sure that he was honored because of the impact he had on the school. By the way, he and Jeff Morton, I think, were two extraordinary leaders in this school, along with Roland McKinley, who basically was able to gain us access to this incredible, what I would call, space out here, where every other major parochial private school would have loved to have this campus that we're on here, a university school. But as a result of which, those coaches were just incredible. And back in the day, it's not so much different today, but we had a lot of mandates where the teachers were coaches. So we didn't have a lot of hired guns that came in to coach. And I don't say that disrespectfully, but they knew us in the classroom. And if they knew us in the classroom, they knew us on the field. They were able to influence and impact our lives in a very positive way. And through that, reinforce a lot of our core values. And they're sitting on that wall out there, responsibility, loyalty, and consideration. So those guys live that. But I think the coolest thing about Callow and Morton and McKinley, and I could go on and list Coach Devere and a number of people, Ron Grant. I swam on Ron's first ever swim team when he was all of 22 years old. And by the way, he looked younger than half the seniors on our team that year. In fact, go back and take a look at some of the photos. But Mr. Grant obviously went on to have an incredibly illustrious career and was a quality guy. And back then, he and his wife, actually, they lived on the Shaker campus where they ran the dormitory. Wow. Back when we had dorm kids here and just great people. So Ron and Callow, and there was Donald Moten. Oh my God, I could go on. But the coaches that really were also our teachers were the ones that I learned so much from. How did that impact your decision? Because I know like you coach now, how did that impact your decision to later coach freshman football? Well, it's funny. When we were going through a transition from Jim Stevens, I had some little bit of responsibility in trying to re-recruit Ben Malbesa, who graduated from the U.S. to come back to university. And he had been at Elyria and I think Notre Dame Cathedral Latin and a variety of places. And I knew that ostensibly his heart was us, you know, here at university school. So we were lucky to get him. And I swim in the morning here, as you guys may or may not know. And I got Ben to come swim with me. And he's always been after me after I retired from Oswald Companies, a firm that I had the good fortune of being with for 35 odd years. He says, well, what are you going to do when you retire? And I said, well, you know, I always wanted to coach. I always wanted to be Coach Callow. And my dad was the one that said to me, well, you know, you ought to think about the economics of that, you know, because I literally wanted when I graduated from Williams, my senior project was coaching at the lower school. So I always wanted to be a coach. And I coached kids in swimming and whatnot growing up at the Meadow Harbor Yacht Club. But notwithstanding, when he offered me the opportunity to come coach, and then I realized last year when I first stepped in that I was drinking from a fire hydrant. I had no clue whatsoever what they were doing from offensive schemes, defensive schemes, the sophistication. Carlo and his training I was like overwhelmed. I go, man, I don't know if I can deal with this. And I'm still pretty much overwhelmed, but it's been an absolute blast because hanging out with you guys to me is everything. And it's given me a lot of, you know, excitement and energy. And it's just been so cool to hang out with guys like you. Many people compare, they say sports reflect life. How do you feel football reflects life? And what lessons have you gained? Teamwork. It's not about me. It's about we. And we build a company, the Oswald Company, is based upon the philosophy of we are us with a mission of caring, caring for our clients and our employee owners, period. End of conversation. And that was backed up by our core values and our core values, which frankly, I handle a lot to do in drafting. The acronym was PERC, P-I-R-C. Passion for excellence, integrity in all relationships, resourcefulness, and commitment to community. Now, if you think about that, a lot of the sports background that I had contributed to not only those core values, but the mission, of caring, and I think that in and of itself is what I learned from sports, individual and or teamwork. It just was all about us, U.S. If there was a single word that you could add to that mission statement today, do you have anything that you would add? Sure, commitment. We had commitment to each other. And those that frankly came to work with me that didn't have that same commitment and culture of wanting to give back or didn't want to live by the core values, we hip-checked them because they became battery drainers, not battery chargers. And to me, the most important thing is you want to have the right chemistry, right, in all that you do in life. And when you find people that are basically not bad people per se, but they don't want to follow the party line, it's time for them to go. Where does that motivation come from? And what is kind of, we always talk about it, what is your why? Wanting to work collaboratively and collegially with others. Enjoying not my success, but their success and realizing that by empowering and helping others, good things will happen and all boats will rise. You know, it's like the boys in the boat. And again, I stated, a little bit earlier, Charlie, Jack, when you really focus on the we and not the me, great things happen. And I think selfless behavior is critical. I think your involvement in the community, whether in my case, it was with the United Way or the Cleveland Leadership Center, or pick a number of the other entities that I had the responsibility of working with and for, including your university school, which was, to this day, my greatest joy in serving as a member of our board of trustees. The ability to see this school and, frankly, other non-profits in this community grow by recruiting and developing and bringing teamwork to others, that, to me, was the most important thing. And then, as I stated earlier, what was the most important thing? Relationships, relationships, relationships. So I feel very blessed in that regard. There's a quote from Winston Churchill that reads, we make a living by what we get, but we make a life by what we give. It's become apparent you value caring for people and you've had a successful career in the insurance sector, but have also had an extensive reach through philanthropy. While you have made your living through insurance, do you feel your purpose has been fulfilled? In your philanthropic work? You know, Jack, that's a great question. I'm going to answer it in kind of an odd lot way. That's fine.

When I see my three sons, Larry, Curly, and Mo, Matt, 02, Kyle, 03, and Gregory, 05, sustain that legacy where they give their time and energy back not only to their families who they love and trust and respect, but to their communities. Kyle is currently a teacher of international baccalaureate economics. At Gulliver Prep Academy, but he teaches business and entrepreneurship right now. And to see him take his students and get them active in the community. My son Gregory is in Westfield, New Jersey with his beautiful wife and children. Seeing him get back active in the community, what he does within the framework of the folks in that town, and notably my son Matt, who is currently one of the board members of the State Club Foundation, which incorporates a number of guys from St. Ignatius and St. Ed's, yeah, the Westside guys. And they have got a nonprofit where they're putting money and people and time and volunteer back into a number of different nonprofits in the community and it crosses all lines. That's what, in my mind, if I see my grandchildren also, which we have seven, five girls, two boys, also, sustain that sort of commitment, giving back of their time, energy, and effort, and financially if they can afford it, that will be the legacy that I will be most proud of. What have you learned from the failure in your life? That was a callow thing. He always would tell us, guys, you know, the man has not judged his character by when he wins, but how he loses. And I used to have that saying on my wall in my office. And as a result of which, Jack, perfectly candid with you,

the losses, the rejection, the adversity, the ability to overcome the challenges that are thrown at you in life and have a positive, upbeat outlook, on, hey, I got knocked down, I'll get up again. Chumbawamba, that's a song, by the way. I got knocked down, I get up again, you're never going to get me down. That's been how I've always felt. So, several years ago, the good Lord dealt me an interesting hand. I had stage four cancer, and it wasn't looking good. And instead of going down in the mouth, fortuitously, two of my buddies, Brian Bowell, class of 73, and Jim Persky, class of 73, were outstanding doctors. Jim did surgery on me, and Brian was the head of the Towson Cancer Lab. And these guys immediately, U.S. Connections, maroon and black blood cells, man, they came through for me, and they go, Burns, you've got to try this thing called immunotherapy, it may work for you. That's why I'm here with you guys today. But always kept a positive attitude, convinced that, hey, we'll make it through. And I had a great support system with my family and siblings, and my boys. I have a question. I mean, we always talk about this, usually with students, but this is kind of like, as a former student of yours, obviously all this different stuff has had to build up in stress, or sometimes when there's those late nights where you just need to keep on working, working, and working. How have you gone past that? And what's always gone through your mind in those moments of just extreme stress and extreme pressure? Well, Charlie, that's a really complex answer that I'm going to make real simple. The sun was going to come out the next day. There would be a tomorrow. And always recognizing that there's going to be sunshine and blue skies. You've got to find the silver lining, as they say on every playbook. And I was blessed to be able to do that. And yeah, I mean, I worked very hard, you know, 18-hour days, and, you know, really sacrificed a lot of time, energy, and effort. But I always try to maintain a balance. And I had a wonderful wife. Vicki and I have been married, my high school sweetheart, for 48 years. And we produced three great sons and beautiful daughter-in-laws and great kids. And, you know, family's critical. And I think one of the things that I do, I did, to be honest with you, that I really felt proud about was in my leadership roles, going from a salesman into leading a division at a company and ultimately building out the responsibility as a CEO and as chairman of our company in a leadership role, or even here at University School in some regards, is I always felt empowered to empower others. And always knew there was somebody else out there that would have the definitive resources, the expertise, that if I could bring them along, they could excel. And again, all boats would rise. So whenever I felt stress, I thought, well, what is the stress related to? It's about something I don't know. And I don't need to solve all the problems of the world. I just need to know the right people who can solve those problems with me. So, you know, you find the outfielder, you find the first baseman, you find the right catcher, you find the right swimmer. Instead of doing the sprints, he's going to do the road. You find the right receiver. You know, you got to find the right people to work with along the way. And they're back to the question of sports and working with others in order to say, okay, what's the greatest good for the greatest number? We're utilitarian. What's the goal? Where do we want to be? And then I think one of the things that helped me consistently eliminate the stress was I always worked out. I'm kind of like one of these village idiots. So, you know, I had great health in my life. And I think a lot of that byproduct in terms of nutrition and what I ate. But most importantly, my consistency in jogging or working out, I think really contribute a lot to my mental health. I think people falter in that realm because they fall into the wrong pattern. My drug was working out and that was uplifting, right? Because, any time I felt down in the mouth, I'd go for a long run or, I don't know, take a swim. You know, we have a little tradition in asking our guests on the show if they've had unlimited power at U.S., what would they like to change? Since you've had the opportunity to see the world even on a broader scale, could you tell us one thing you really think you would like to change in the world to make it a better place? Well, I don't have to talk about it. I want to tell you what we're doing. It's called the Byrne Scholar Program, which basically takes capital, provides you guys with the opportunity, the avenue from which to explore ways in which you can enrich your own life, but more importantly, others in this community by giving back. And that is just beginning to take off. We had our first core of guys last year that participated, including Mikey Malone and, oh my gosh, Cam Ryder and Aiden and others. And this year, you know, looking at the playbook of guys that we have, the roster, very impressive. So whatever I can do to support that and see that consistently grow, but I'm going to answer that not just with the Byrne Scholar Program because that sounds a little too egotistical. I want to go back to a meeting that you guys don't even know that I was in probably 25 years ago. When I first joined the board, they elevated me for whatever stupid reason to the executive committee and I was the youngest guy there by decades, other than one or two guys. And I'll never forget sitting in a meeting with the most amazing guys in the world. I mean, just legends in this community. Jack Turbin, Bill Conway, Herrick, all the names of the guys who, you guys know of in this town and I could go on and John Alpcold, et cetera, and Henry Meyer who was probably only about eight years older than I was at the time. And we sat there at a meeting and we talked about what should our endowment be and why would we want to increase our endowment? And I sat and I listened to the dialogue at that meeting and what struck me was the fact that they were setting their sights not high enough. So I made a comment. I said, we're a $100 million endowment stuck in a $10 million set of shoes. And it was like dead silence. And I said, guys, if we're going to be able to provide scholarships and financial aid to wonderful young men that come from all cross sections of this community, north, south, west, wherever, not too many north because that would take them into Canada although that would be bad for a few hockey players. Gilmore's doing that. But my point is I really wanted to see us bolster our endowment to take care of not only great young potential students like the Jarvis Scholars and whatnot, the Bill Obendorf who is a great friend of mine and graduated a year ahead of me both at U.S. and at Williams. Has been able to fund. So it was thinking bigger, outside the box, stretching the school, the mindset of our trustees and thinking, gosh, you know, we've got these two extraordinary campuses but who are we going to onboard them in the future and with whom and populate them with? We want the best and the brightest. And they don't necessarily have to come out of Shaker Heights or Cleveland Heights or Orange or Pepper Pike. They're going to come from Mentor. They're going to come from Painesville. They're going to come from Akron. They're going to come from, you know, all points of the community. Newberry. I mean, pick your spot, right? Kirtland. It doesn't matter. Going back to that Burns Scholars Program. Yeah. It's really interesting. Like, what was your really vision for that program at the very beginning and what was the moment where you were like, yes, this is something I want to do and give back to the U.S. community? Well, when U.S. got involved with the Young Entrepreneurship Program and then got tied into the Cleveland Leadership Center, which I had something to do with, and then we got into the Accelerate Program, to me the idea of social venture capital was absolutely critical. You've got to make money to give money, guys. I mean, it just doesn't grow on trees. So the ideation or the thrust for that was to be able to say, guys, can you come up with ways in which you can create revenue, i.e. dollars, income, cash, that you can redeploy back and do something good with it, okay, and let your minds wander. I mean, and therein lies the opportunity for the Burns Scholars Program. But you've got to come up with cool ideas. What do you think the importance of using money towards other people is instead of using it for yourself? Okay. Well, it starts with, first of all, my upbringing, which I told you, my parents worked their tail off to give back to me. And so I was imbued with that from day one. So it was my responsibility to make sure that Vicki and I had the ability, I had to work hard and work smart to be able to earn enough to send our three boys to university school. And as a result of which, help also with my boys today and my grandchildren's education, which I think is absolutely critical and give them the right of passage to attend, whether it's the Hathaway Browns or the university schools or whatnot. But your question's an interesting one because in business, your goal is to make a profit. I mean, don't kid yourself. All right? We're here to make money and we're here to do the right thing of, by, and for our clients to earn the respect and the trust that goes along with making money. But once you get to a critical point, you know, it's like material things are nice, but guess what? They don't give you the gratification and the satisfaction you have by helping others. I mean, to see a family in poverty, and one in particular, and I think I mentioned this the other day when I was doing, the first ever nonprofit work was when I was doing the Big Brothers out at Williams College and I had a kid that came from a very dysfunctional, abusive family in Powell, Vermont. And this young boy who I was coaching at the time, his mother, he begged me to stay for dinner one night. The reason why was because the father was a drunk and he'd come home and beat him up. And they made me, asked me if I'd stay for dinner. I'm eating there a plate of spaghetti and in comes this guy. And I literally had to confront him. And it was just an awakening for me about, I grew up with a wonderful mother and father and certainly the greatest caring people in the world. And here this young boy who I am coaching and mentoring and trying to help, he goes home every night to a father that comes home and beats him. And I'm thinking, this is not right. And so, I mean, having those life experiences, Jack,

it's kind of a wake-up call. And it kind of goes back to, okay, what can I do for others? And it goes beyond cars and boats and trains and planes and nice clothes and fancy, you know, what I would, what I would call dinners and things like that. You know what I mean? You know, in a second, we're going to ask you if, like, you can give a word to any of the students about what they would want. But almost as a unique perspective as an alumni, what word would you give to other U.S. alumni about maybe giving back to U.S. or just giving back in general? Well,

in a commencement speech, the greatest honor that I've ever had in my life was I, I was asked by Mr. Gallagher and Mr. Gallagher and Dr. Hollington at that time, board of our trustees, to give the commencement speech to the university school in 23. And here's what I'd like to share with you guys today if you don't mind. I've got some notes here. First, spend time with those you love, trust, and respect. A little repetitive, but engage with battery chargers and hip check battery drainers who are arrogant, self-serving, and narcissistic. Next, work hard to be not a good, not a good, but a great listener and enter into relationships with those who seek to understand before they are understood. These are typically people who are caring, compassionate, like many of you, you two guys in particular, have great empathy. Next, rely on your gut and be cautious when you meet very smart people who lack emotional intelligence. Remember, guys, IQ minus EQ, emotional quotient, equals miscue. Kindness, consideration, gentlemen, goes a long way. Responsibly give your time, guided by your passion to your community. And when you do, you're going to get a lot of money charitable organizations that will benefit from your volunteer work. Stay in shape, mentally and physically. Health is wealth. And sing like the Glee Club. It lightens the load. Finally, expect the unexpected. The old adage, things happen for a reason, has merit. Although in all candor, things will just happen, independent of any reason or esoteric purpose. Wow. That is, that is really, really, really cool. Take a minute to process. Oh, yeah. I mean, as one of those seniors, I mean, I would personally be blown away. And what was really trying to, trying to go back to like your life in general, what lessons in your life really helped you make that speech and like built together what you wanted to tell the class of 23? Those guys blew me away because like you guys, they were here through the pandemic. But, you know, given the fact pattern that they were going through at that time, their sophomore, junior year, and then they finally broke out their senior year and they could come together.

It's interesting. Patrick Gallagher in their yearbook wrote about what a unique class they were. And I trust you guys will have a unique class independently and respectively as well. But my parting gift to those guys that I honestly, intellectually, and emotionally offered them was I told them this. I said, independent of their chronological age, independent of the college they attend, independent of their future spouse, partner, family, career, or profession, independent of health and financial issues or challenges that they encounter, and independent of hard knocks, setbacks, and adversity, and independent of all the stuff that happens for a reason or not, I told them to keep intact that vibrant, energetic, positive 18-year-old mindset that Mr. Gallagher identified in their yearbook. I told them to stay connected, watch their front while their peers and classmates watch their back. And I said, never, and I mean never, lose the spirit of your youth. What those guys learned and what you guys learned living through the pandemic triggered, in fact, in my mind, it ignited your bond of brotherhood for life. You'll never stand alone. I told them, don't ever fool the man in the mirror. As the great country singer Toby Keith sang, don't let the old man in, but always revel in Alice Cooper's 1970s classic, I'm 18 and I like it. I'm 18 and I love it. I'm 18, 18, 18, 18, 18 and I like it. It was really the greatest privilege and honor I've ever had. And those guys were like lit up like eight Hanukkah kettles on a Christmas tree that day. All 100 of them standing there in the sun. It was just a beautiful day and I was very blessed to have had that opportunity. So thanks, Charlie. One of the last things I wanted to ask you is you've talked about battery chargers and battery drainers throughout this interview. How do you become a battery charger? Like what, what, what traits do you see in battery chargers versus traits you see in battery drainers? Sure. People have goals. People have goals that are just not of, by, and for them, but of, by, and for others. Positive mental attitude. The ability to overcome adversity, as I mentioned. The ability to consistently wake up and see it's sun's out today. Sunshine, blue skies, man. It's going to work. I think sustainability of a positive attitude is absolutely critical in life. No matter what confronts you, when it confronts you, and how you confront. And I don't mean to sound like, you know, there's, sunshine, blue sky guy. I mean, you know, we all go through challenges. But I think people that keep their wheels under them and can give back positive energy, positive energy to a positive attitude to others, they're battery chargers. And when you see battery drainers, guys that are walking around and go, poor me, victim mentality, and all that sort of stuff, see you later. And I would walk away, I literally, from people who work with me, or even clients, that I didn't think ethically or morally I wanted to have anything to do with. Because I just didn't have any respect for them. And that goes back to university school. Because they didn't, we, our teachers, our, Mr. McKinley, guys like that, they didn't tolerate anything. But expecting the best of you, by you, and for you, and making sure that you understood what responsibility, loyalty, and consideration really meant, and you lived those values, guys. Yeah, I mean, these were just three words on a wall. You bought into it, you lived it, and more importantly, you made sure others were basically pairs of yours that were tagline, to that. That make sense? Hey, guys. Well, Mr. Burns, it has been a truly inspiring podcast, having you on the show today. I'm really grateful for the opportunity to learn more about your incredible journey and the values that drove you. Thank you so much for taking the time to share your thoughts and insights for life. To our listeners, thank you so much for tuning in, and we hope you'll join us next Wednesday for another episode of The Lead Start Show. Thank you, Mr. Burns. Thank you, Shirley. Thank you.